retired_florentino

It occured to me today, while I was updating my Chester Blues thread that a fundamental change has occured in the CM4 game.

Assuming (like in other CM games) the money levels in the game will be steady, it will be necessary in a long term game for a club to stop living the title-chasing dream.

Let me explain. Chester City (in the game above) currently are below their Wage Budget, but still make a loss of about £70k a month. Gate Receipts are about £800k pa but Ground Maintenance costs are about £750k pa. This gives Chester a total Wage budget (assuming other incomes and expenditures are equal) of £50k pa. Or £1000 per week.

So basically - in order to get Chester into profitable positions again (which with a current debt of £4.5m I must do soon) I will have to slash the squad size, including deposing of those players who will get me up into league football (this season I hope).

My question to LLM Managers is this : at what point will the required profitability of your club take precedence over your promotion / title aspirations?

retired_nekh_20

I have always played the game title chasing first, finances second. I have also stayed close to the fact that I manage and the chairman sorts finances etc.

I really would like to see how this works in CM4. I have noticed now with the added wage budget that i constantly look through my team looking at who i can sacrafice in order to stay under the budget.

The game is more realistic and with that, i think most LLMers will be looking at the players they have and do the same as me, trying to salvage a decent sqaud as well as staying under the budgets. Especially as the board aren't very happy when you are heading towards the red.

Only time will tell i suppose.

retired_florentino

Does it ever get to the point where a club goes completely bankrupt and refuses to pay wages??

I've seen a couple of clubs make it out of administration - but they were few and far between to be honest, especially compared to some of the clubs that have gone into administration.

(I'm crapping myself at the moment with Chester coz I can see us completely shutting down :p)

retired_nekh_20

I rememmber somone from SI saying that clubs being shut down will not be included in CM4.

retired_florentino

So what's the long term prospects for football as a sport in CM4?

Masses of debt as completely ineffective administrators try to balance the books at almost every club in the united kingdom?

retired_florentino

I know that profitability will get slightly easier as someone managed to convince the devs that ground maintenance was a little excessive outside the league, especially for professional clubs. So in effect, outgoings will change slightly for the majority of clubs that are really struggling (i.e. LLM clubs).

Perhaps players wages and expectations will start to come down as more and more footballers find themselves out of work.

A recent example in my game would be a certain Coventy, Aston Villa and Moroccan midfielder, who for some reason is now playing for a Conference side for £800 per week.

retired_florentino

Yeah I know exactly what you mean. The Birmingham City general manager (I can't remember her name) went on record as saying "We can be a perfectly profitable league side or we can dream the dream" about being in the Premiership.

The clubs that didn't count on money being there from a TV deal certainly have done far better than before.

Personally - I am aiming to start moving towards that break-even point as soon as I reach the football league (if you've been following my Chester career you'll know I haven't made it out of the conference yet).

I'll be cutting down on the established first team players and have far more young and upcoming talent. Hopefully this, combined with the expected increase in gate receipts that come with promotion should allow me to start slashing a debt which I expect to be around the £5m mark at the end of the current season.

retired_Augussta

I have had similar thoughts to you Dave regarding the harsh financial reality of CM4 and have found that you end up selling some of your decent players just to keep a lid on wages. Spent the first season concentrating as much on reducing the wage budget as chasing promotion. Now in February of my second season still have 6 of the start-up squad in my first choice XI, could rarely have said that for CM3 games.

Currently just holding off Barnet at the top of the Conference and have to admit I'm not planning big changes on the playing side if we get promoted. Will let a few players contracts expire and see how my squad get on before recruiting. This is probably more like real life and I think that the balance between board and manager is just about right in the game. The board try to exercise financial control through restricting the wage and transfer budget - the rest is down to you. The game could probably be more strict in forcing the manager to adhere to the wage buget than at present, but the penalties of spiralling into debt seem bad enough.

I have to say it is more of a challenge and I am enjoying it!

retired_princess160

I have always tried to first iron out the finances, then turn a bunch of sadly and unfairly underpaid youngsters into a lean mean footballing machine. Sales of said youngsters also help, financially, which usually makes the board happy. Which in turn helps me keep my job. And that is a prerequisite for my style: I have no problem staying on the lowest level for ages (See my Lidingö carreer, documented in this forum). Long term goals (and who would challenge the statement, that, for example, taking Northwich Vics to the Prem isn't a long term goal? ) take a long time to achieve.

retired_florentino

Perhaps somewhat stupidly - I've formed a long term plan that involves getting Chester into the football league and then sorting out the finances.

My thinking behind this is that the higher gate receipts should serve to help balance out the incredibly high Ground Maintenance costs.

£4.5m debt
Expect it to be closer to £5.5m by the end of the current season.