retired_happydawg

I am far better in sorting out tactics IRL than in FM2007. So, perhaps the easiest way to try to assist you is to refer you to page 35 of the FM 2007 in game manual. There , it gives you the definitions and parameters for both "offside" and "counter attack".

For what it is worth, my personal only, preference is for using counter attacking, possibly in all matches. [Cleon, somewhere recently I think, has posted a good and intelligent piece along the counter attacking lines.] Forgive the over use of the word "I" but I feel that playing offside is an even money gamble that at least once in any match is going to cost a goal.

With counter attacking you always have players back to hopefully, stem all attacks and if you have employed your tactics correctly, start one of your own. I hope that this may give you some food for thought and bring success to all your efforts. Kind regards.

retired_touchofklass

oescus,

I use FM 2006, but when I asked about the differences between '05, '06 and '07 (in the Tactics Bible topic), Cleon answered that it was 99% all the same. So let's assume that it is true.

I have looked into my FM2006 manual (page 25) and it states the following:

I assume that this means that players that know each other (well the orginal team does, when you start the game, don't they?) keep an eye onto each other and deploy this offside trap.

I don't know what overstretch means. Can someone explain that to me?

What I do understand is that I let the opponent have more space on my side of the field.

So I think that you are right. Offside trap and counterattack are not that good together.

Hmm, one might try a normal defensive line to be somewhere in between and to have both... but, again, I think I should only use one.

So that is then allready one thing that I have learned today :-)

retired_touchofklass

Melench,

Thanks for testing and commenting on my tactics.

Giving them space everywhere is not what I wanted. I wanted to let my team use all the available space. Not have [I}"gatenkaas"[/I]. (Translates as cheese with holes in it.)

Balls over the top? What do you mean by that? (Please notice that English is not my native language.)
Do you mean long ball passing? Or do you mean deep assists? Or both? Or something else?
Is that also the reason why in the match statistics my heading is always pretty low?

I had matches where they worked pretty good together, but also a lot of matches where they were everywhere, just like you say.
The strangest thing is that, though my leftback and rightback have a more advancing mentality than my centrebacks, and even though they also have farrows to the wingback position, it are often the centre backs that advance more, while the wingbacks stay behind in the centre.
Perhaps this is explainable. Or it could also be that I have not looked good enough, but I find that very strange.

1. OK. So not to much advancing on the field. Gives me more time to defend, yes?
2. OK. So I guess my fullbacks stay fullbacks and do not function as wingbacks all the time. (So no more fielding Srna & Zebina?)
FR is forward runs, yes? So they now only advance when they think it is safe, I think. I always select my defenders with high descision making.
3. Why did you change the CB and FB to 6/7 and 8/9? Aren't they to much away from the midfield then? (I used Synax' guide to decide what mentality they have.) Or wait... I am confused (and I do not have my game on, at this time) did you give them a more advances, or a lower mentality?
4. OK. My RMC? Did I gave him Forward Runs? That was not what I meant to do Good that you saw that mistake. Only thing I do not understand here, is why he is the playmaker? He has the task to watch out and back up anything that the midfield interaction could encounter. But then again, he is the only of the 3 midfielders that has a "static position" where the LMC and DMC may have some more "fun". Perhaps you can explain this a bit more to me.
5. Who? All? Can you be a bit more specific.

Well that is what I had in mind. So the midfield is good (when I remove the FR from the RMC and make him the playmaker as you say).

You didn't change the width. That was allready good?
Well, thank you for what you have done for me so far. I will change this when I play next and look into the results.


If anyone has more ideas in what is allready good (midfield, I hope ) and what isn't good yet (defense, but that will be changed), feel free to comment! :thup:

retired_happydawg

My interpretation of "overstretch" within the confines of FM2007 is this. An attacking team will "overstretch" when it pushes too many players forward. Thereby leaving, theoretically, a vast expanse of space behind their defenders which a defending counter attacking team will take advantage of, either with quick balls to fast wingers or long balls over the top to the strikers.

retired_kaylab

Both. As there is a very large gap between your defense and your goalkeeper. This can be exploited by pacey strikers.


1. correct
2. Yes FR = forwards runs. Even with "mixed FR" on the Fulbacks, they still suport attacks a lot . In fact in a lot of my games they get quite a few assists for goals.
3. I kept the same mentality, so the gap betwen midfield and defense is the same. However, with lower closing down, they do not get "pulled" out of position as much, leaving less gaps for opposition strikers to exploit.
4. I made him playmaker as he is always available to recieve a pass. This was only made possible when i changed his FR to "rarely".
5. My mistake, I meant to say.. i gave the FC forwards runs "often". This gives the playmaker more options, especially if the FC has a lot of pace ( i was using Obafemi Martins at newcastle).

yes, and the playmaker has a lot of options when on the ball. As he can see all the play in front of him. My playmaker (Emre) constantly played curling balls out to the wings for the winger to run onto. (amazing to see).

Yes i kept the width, i found it got the most out of my wingers.

I made a few other "tweaks" can't quite remember exactly what. I might upload a copy of the tactic and a PKM file.

Lots of potential in the tactic though.

I will try to defensive one next, being Newcastle it will be a real test! As their defence is awful. With little pace or skill.

will update you later

retired_touchofklass

oescus,

Thanks for explaining what overstretch means. I understand what you mean. If too much players go forward then we'll end up having big gaps on the fields for any countering team to exploit, yes? So I'll have to make sure that this does not happen. I think that is what Melench did when he changed some parts in my tactic. When giving the FB's and CB's an other (smaller) closing down, they are playing more where they should and thus (hopefully) avoiding the gaps which occur when overstretching.

Again, thanks for commenting/testing.
=====================================

Melench,

I cannot say how glad/relieved I am that one part of my tactic (Home-tactic's midfield) is so decent allready, while this was only the first time that I attempted to make it like that. I moved some sliders, ticked some boxes and looked at it... to see that it worked pretty good. (When I first started making this tactic I used another savegame - managing Celtic - but as I am much more familiar with Ajax it was easier to make it with them.)

Perhaps it is very team-related but I had the most succes so far with this tactic with Ajax. Testing it with Bordeaux, Australia & Wolfsburg (this savegame) and Celtic (previous savegame) was not yet so succesfull. I am glad that with Newcastle it works pretty good too.

About 3, when I finished typing, I realised that you indeed meant closing down and ofcourse not mentality. I play my game 95% of the time in Dutch, so I have to translate everytime I type or read here. So point 3 is cleared too.

About 5, that is cleared too. I found it very strange to first remove and then add FR's. So the striker runs often forward. I will change that too.

I am very interested to see how you changed my tactic further. So if you can upload it, that would be great.

Again, thank you for testing/commenting.
=========================

If anyone has another idea/tip/etc, please feel free to tell me. :thup:

retired_touchofklass

Melench,

One question allready about my defensive tactic (you mean away tactic or defend lead?).
Do you think that when I keep the same midfield as with the home-formation, is that possible without farrows? Or, is it possible to keep the farrows for the midfielders, without being to attacking for a defensive tactic?

retired_touchofklass

At the moment my tactic performs very inconsistent. After leaving Ajax, I played with Bordeaux and Wolfsburg, and not very succesfull. Though I managed to get nice wins, I also got some terrible losses. At the beginning of the 4th season I changed jobs again, and I am coaching Heerenveen now.

Here my tactic seems to do great in some matches and again performs very bad in others. I managed to win from Feyenoord with 3-0, losing to PSV with about the same. I lost from Ado Den Haag with 6-2, where I won a few days later with 5-0 from Utrecht.

The only place where my tacticpack functions very well, is the Australian National Team. I qualified for '08 Olympics with the under-23's and got the bronze medal. With the Australian National Team, I am currently leading my group to qualify for the 2010 WC in South Africa. I have the best playing team in Asia right now. But, that is not so strange, being in a group with no real opposition. (China, South Korea, play in other groups.)

If anyone could check my tactics please, and tell me what to improve, that would be great. (I allready changed the things that were mentioned earlier. It goes better but absolutely not perfect.)

retired_touchofklass

The tactics that are hosted on "Football Manager Downloads", are still the first versions. I think it is only necessary to upload new versions, when I have updated them a bit more. (= I am performing better.)

Please feel free to download and comment.
Thanks in advance.

Jorgen

retired_susans

Hey jorgen... First of all great tactic i dont now if its count but im playing whit man utd.and so far i played 19 games playing whit both the home and away tactic... 15 win 3 draw and only 1 lose (to charlton in the fa cup .... resting all the stars and lose 3-1) the only thing i changed was the defensive line in the home tactic.. 4 steps back