retired_haynesleighe

Unfortunately, that is going to be very hard as most of what he says is true. He misses a lot of issues out too, such as:

Copying large amounts of data - Sometimes Vista will stop part-way through, without warning.

Automatic Driver Updates - Can occasionally cause Vista to become unbootable.

Lack of internet connection for an unspecified length of time causes vista to unactivate itself, requiring you to re-activate using their phone system or buy a new copy. This has happened to me twice now in less than a month (most recently this morning).

Deleting multiple files and folders - The area showing how long is left and the amount of files to be deleted changes almost randomly so you never know how long is left.

DRM technology for next-generation technologies (Blu-ray/HD etc) built into the OS can reduce the quality of media not fitting certain Microsoft criteria.

Defragmentation - Done automatically by Vista with absolutely no visual representation. Apparently, Vista does this at scheduled intervals so you don't forget. Of course, if the PC isn't on it doesn't happen. Also, as it does most other things poorly, why should I trust this important task to it?


There are many other examples I could give but if this isn't enough to put someone off then nothing is.

retired_tamifc

Unfortunately, that is going to be very hard as most of what he says is true. He misses a lot of issues out too, such as:

Copying large amounts of data - Sometimes Vista will stop part-way through, without warning.

Automatic Driver Updates - Can occasionally cause Vista to become unbootable.

Lack of internet connection for an unspecified length of time causes vista to unactivate itself, requiring you to re-activate using their phone system or buy a new copy. This has happened to me twice now in less than a month (most recently this morning).

Deleting multiple files and folders - The area showing how long is left and the amount of files to be deleted changes almost randomly so you never know how long is left.

DRM technology for next-generation technologies (Blu-ray/HD etc) built into the OS can reduce the quality of media not fitting certain Microsoft criteria.

Defragmentation - Done automatically by Vista with absolutely no visual representation. Apparently, Vista does this at scheduled intervals so you don't forget. Of course, if the PC isn't on it doesn't happen. Also, as it does most other things poorly, why should I trust this important task to it?


There are many other examples I could give but if this isn't enough to put someone off then nothing is. </BLOCKQUOTE>

As I have never owned and rarely use Vista, I'm always reluctant to slate it myself.

But almost everything you've said, I have heard from other disgruntled users. On numerous occasions. I know the o.p. was enquiring only about the viability of FM on a Vista machine...but food for thought is always a good thing :thup:

retired_terata

At some point in a suitable thread it's a debate worth having, but when one of his first gripes is 'ooh they renamed some stuff in the control panel' it'll need to not be at 00:22hrs when I need to work tomorrow.

He's covered a couple of issues, but I've built 32 machines for people in the last year with Vista Home Premium and Vista Ultimate mostly 32 bit but a few with 64 bit like mine.

I seldom see the Vista ones back, but the older XP builds are infected or corrupted by something so regularly that I see a repair or rebuild every month. (I've not had a single hit on my Vista machines yet)

Also, 64 bit drivers are really fine, especially since it seems some effort goes into them as opposed to run of the mill 32bit drivers. I've got drivers for all my hardware and didn't have to look far either.

I'm running a Desktop (E6850/4GB) with Vista Ultimate 64 vLited, a Dell XPS M1530 Notebook (T7700/4GB) with Vista Home Premium 32, a Dell Inspiron 9300 Laptop (Centrino 1.73/1GB) with XPSP2 nLited, and an HP Pavilion DV1000 (Celeron 1.6/512MB) with XPSP2.

They each have their quirks, but Vista is miles ahead of XP.

Couple of key issues tho:

As with XP - prebuilds are guff - install it yourself. Prebuilds have so much crud installed these days. Dell and HP are bad, but PC world and the likes seem to bundle even more.

Vista uses more RAM because it's meant to use less slow-ass hard drive.

My Vista 64 Ultimate has been vLited from 3.5GB down to 1.4GB, yup that's how much guff MS had to put in the default install to make it user friendly. OSX would be fubared to if it was ever installed on such a wide base of hardware. 655MB of printer drivers, 1GB of speech recog which noone really needs, and almost a GB of Chinese, Jap, and Korean language files... urrgh.

Having dual booted mine initially it humped the life out XP in bechmarks, and despite my initial dislike I'm now loathing using XP for work and certain unvistaready apps.

It's a question of change and a lot of peoples rants can be loosely translated into 'don't like change' or 'don't understand technology'.

That said, each of us will likely have a different experience, some love FM some hate, some lvoe Vista some hate, some love OSX, Ubuntu, Linux et al, and some hate.

retired_terata

It is, but the polarised opinions on FM GQ are an idea of how that which some hate others will love. This place is proper hostile at times, infact I recall us having a 'coming together' a while ago and all because our opinion of the game and our perception of others comments differ.

Much the same with Vista. £100 million users now and many loving it many not, it's all relative to the experience, and that very experience is unique to each of us in terms of PC knowhow, tech knowledge, hardware, patience, usage, and expectations.

For every one of me having a ball, there's someone else having a mare.

I see a wee lad has been trawling forums for weeks (jwt004?) unable to make FM2008 run on his laptop. Vista and FM are both getting caned by all comers, but in reality it's the preinstalled graphics drivers causing the issue, that, and the lack of ATI/nVidia upgrades to laptop based drivers.

I've yet to stick FM2008 on the XPS M1530 which is new, but I'll be miffedif shoddy drivers give me all that white screen nonsense.

retired_haynesleighe

I have it on two machines due to having to give support to other people as part of my business.

I am starting to get really upset with a certain large PC chain that keeps selling Vista to elderly users who have no intention of using the internet. They are never asked about their intended use and within a couple of weeks their operating system accuses them of software piracy. After speaking first to the place the bought it and then with Microsoft (who say they must have done something wrong and it is their own fault and should buy another copy) they bring them to me in desperation. A 15-minute phone call later and they are re-activated but will have to do this on a very regular basis in order to use a PC they paid good money for.

In my opinion, Microsoft have stepped over one boundary too many and should have no right whatsoever to assume that any person will use their PC in a "Microsoft-approved" way. It is my PC and it is my choice what I do with it.

Vista on my laptop is for mobile diagnostics and is never intended for internet use. Unfortunately, that means I am not using my PC as Microsoft dictate therefore I continue to have to re-activate it on a regular basis (leaving complaint after complaint with them to which I am still waiting for a response to).

The sooner a viable alternative for home users comes along the better as Microsoft seems more intent on helping big media corporations protect their content than thinking about the millions of people who keep them in business each time they release an OS.

I am doing a roaring trade in selling XP to users with this problem (I install it and transfer all of their data for free, they only pay for the OS) but feel that these customers should be better informed by those that claim to be the PC experts.

retired_tamifc

Regarding the hostility on the forums, and I'm not trying to simplify the issue, but I think it comes down to people having strong opinions juxtaposed against people who are opinionated. (The expectation that everyone in receipt of your opinion should also adopt it as their own) And the difference is crucial.

Personally, I regard absolutely everything I say as my opinion and I guess I expect people to assume it is that. I love a good debate and special interest forums are a great arena for that. But I've encountered people who are downright opinionated and the result is ugly.

The trend for jumping straight in with downright abuse though, is something I believe will always exist in a place built for talking the talk and nothing else

Although this particular thread has featured both sides of a particular debate without degenerating at all. Quite refreshing actually :thup:

retired_haynesleighe

Whilst I agree that Vista's security is far more improved (although most people I have spoken to immediately turn off UAC) there are a lot of issues under the hood which most users won't see but will be affected by.

Saying that, for all the bad things I have to say about Vista there are as many good things I could say and when/if a lot of the issues are fixed then Vista will be a great OS.

Unfortunately, until then, there are far too many issues to make it a stable or viable platform for any kind of use which requires accuracy of data and the most important issues, to me at least, will never be "fixed" as they are intended features to prevent piracy.

As I said in another thread a few days ago, I am all for piracy protection but not when that gives any company the right to tell me how to use my PC or inhibits any legal user in any way from using their purchased product.

Also when Blu-ray and HD is more widespread on home PC's and Microsoft's exceedingly intolerant DRM technology kicks in and reduces the quality of purchased materials due to a minor fault with the PC, there will be even more unrest from the masses (unwashed or otherwise).

retired_haynesleighe

I agree. It is refreshing to have a thread where no-one feels the need to act childish because one user disagrees with their opinion. These are the very reasons I joined the forum in the first place. :thup:

I am quite happy to respect McDoul's opinion as, from his experience, Vista has given him little or no problem. My experiences differ and therefore we have a differing of opinion and nothing more.

retired_jackie

Thanks for the input everyone! I guess i'm gonna stay with XP until I build/purchase a new PC. As always FM is a major consideration in this decision.

retired_haynesleighe

No problem.

Hope we didn't bore you too much.