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Originally, this was to be my first ever update thread posted on the forum, but, sadly, it has ended up being a topic about my bitter experiences with an otherwise great LLM game with FM2006 6.0.3.
There will be no update, and I've had to end my saved game due to some problems that I discovered. But I've decided to share my experiences, in case others have run into the same problems or might be thinking about playing in Spain.
I played five seasons with UD Almansa in the Spanish Segunda B, and here are the problems that ultimately ruined my saved game.
1. The game failed to enter my club into the Spanish Copa del Rey on multiple occasions. Almansa was entered into the competition in the first season, because all teams that are newly promoted from the Tercera division go into the cup for the next season, while they are in their first year in the Segunda B.
Afterwards, you need to finish in the top four of your league in the Segunda B in order to qualify. The top four teams from each division of the Segunda B automatically go into the competition for the next year. In our third season, we finished third, but we weren't entered into the cup for the next season. The same thing happened after we finished second in the following year.
So we lost out on potential revenue, and, more importantly, I missed out on a chance to build my reputation through upset wins over bigger clubs.
2. We could not gain promotion because of what I believe to be an unfair factor programmed into the CM/FM series. Since the Segunda B features a playoff system where you must face other top clubs from other divisions, even if you win your league, it is already very difficult to earn promotion. Ultimately, we lost out in the playoffs for three consecutive seasons.
But I'm now convinced that cup results are determined largely based on the reputations of the clubs involved. After playing CM/FM for many years, this has become obvious. The human manager can have an oustanding team, and it can be matched up with a club that has poor talent. But, if that other club has a higher reputation, the human-controlled players will typically play well below their usual standard, while opposing players seem to "up" their game tremendously in cup competitions.
I think this is why cups truly suck arse. We've all found it nearly impossible to achieve much of anything in cup competitions with LLM clubs. And I'm now convinced that club reptuation is why there is a discrepancy.
3. Because of the inability to build a reputation through the cup or promotion, I was unable to get ANY job in Spain once it became clear that I had taken Almansa as far as I could. I could not even get a job at the same level after I decided to leave Almansa. Even crap clubs would not hire me. Ultimately, the only job I could get was with Stafford Rangers in the Nationwide North, and after messing about with the squad and playing a couple of friendlies, I just decided to end my saved game. I was simply too gutted, and I just didn't have the passion to start from the very beggining again. It would have been far more sensible if I could have taken a job with another Segunda B club or moved up to the Segunda A after my stellar performance over five seasons.
4. Unfortunately, I learned through all of this that the Segunda B in Spain, which is otherwise very entertaining and challenging, is essentially unplayable because of the cup bug and the impossibility of overcoming the seeming influence of club reputation in the promotion playoffs. I had unbelievable talent that I had developed from the youth system forward, and my players were superior to virtually every club in the Segunda B. But when it came to the promotion playoff final, when we had to face a club with a bigger reputation like Rayo Vallecano, the players simply forgot how to play.
There is no way that it was down to their "big matches" ratings being low, because they could be dominant in the semifinals. But once there was a much bigger difference in club reputation, like national vs. local, which often happened in the final, we were finished.
Anyway, I don't expect sympathy, and I'm sure that many of you will disagree with my views on reputation, job possibilities, and the like. But I wanted to make the information available for those that might be thinking about playing in Spain. Make sure you know the risks before playing!
Spanish 2nd B Playoff finals also have seen their fair share of bribing the referee.
What I don't get is the fact that you enter the playoffs (thus ending 4th or higher) and don't enter the cup (when the prerequisite is ending 4th or higher).
Some big bug definitely (unless cup structure reflects RL structure, where the FA changes format during the competition to avoid small clubs advancing in the Cup).
However, I must disagree on the it being impossible to win promotion in Spain with a tiny club. You only need tons of perseverance and a tad of luck in the playoffs (just like IRL).
But I'm now convinced that cup results are determined largely based on the reputations of the clubs involved. After playing CM/FM for many years, this has become obvious. The human manager can have an oustanding team, and it can be matched up with a club that has poor talent. But, if that other club has a higher reputation, the human-controlled players will typically play well below their usual standard, while opposing players seem to "up" their game tremendously in cup competitions.
I do not agree with this. I have seen many an example from friends (non LLaMas :eek where they have been managing top teams and have gone out of cup competitions to lower league teams, despite (obviously) have a far superior team and completely owning in thier league. They would claim that there is an unfair ballance against top clubs when a human is in charge!
I'm sorry that you save has, ultimately, been so disappointing for you.
Originally posted by Hogie:
If at first you don't succeed .... Blame SI
Keep going with the save I'm sure in time your reputation will get up to regional and you will have better chance to get promoted.
Actually, based on postings from other LLaMas on my reputation topic, I'm not convinced that my reputation can possible go up in the game. Not without a promotion, which is what keeps me in limbo. So, unfortunately, I can't place any faith in the possiblity of improving my reputation.
Anyway, I've already deleted the copies of my saved game, so there is no going back. It's simply unrealistic and unfair that there is no way to get a job other than working in the bowels of English football, simply because my reputation was never given its proper increase.
Quote:
Originally posted by Gillmacs:
I do not agree with this. I have seen many an example from friends (non LLaMas ) where they have been managing top teams and have gone out of cup competitions to lower league teams, despite (obviously) have a far superior team and completely owning in thier league. They would claim that there is an unfair ballance against top clubs when a human is in charge!
As I mentioned in my original post, I fully expected some people to disagree with my view on club reputation and cup results. As always, there are no absolutes, but I think that cup results take a very different turn when there is a large difference in reputation between the two clubs involved, and one happens to be a human managed club with a lower reputation.
I have no doubt that human clubs with bigger reputations will still crash out in cups to lower league sides. But lower league does not always mean lower reputation. We need to know exactly what the differences in reputation are when those teams meet. Also, in those cases, the AI is controlling the lower league club, and perhaps the reputation factor is not in play or the AI knows how to overcome it.
But, when a human is controlling the club with a lower reputation and is facing a team that has a reputation of two or more places above it, then that's when it seems like the game favours reputation over tactics and talent.
In the end, I've learned not to play in Spain ever again unless SI fixes the reputation problems with the 2007 version. If we end up stuck with this completely unrealistic system that keeps human managers saddled with obscure reputations for years on end, even when their clubs have a local reputation, then it's going to be hard to keep investing the time on these saved games. There is almost no way to get ANY other job from a LLM start unless you win promotion, even if you spend 10 years as a class manager.
Some Lessons Learned 
where they have been managing top teams and have gone out of cup competitions to lower league teams, despite (obviously) have a far superior team and completely owning in thier league. They would claim that there is an unfair ballance against top clubs when a human is in charge!
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