retired_tye1234

Well that explains the pro Bush Sentiment

retired_jmathias

Firstly it is fach-idiot not nach.
Second, can you explain, when process of specialisation starts in USA educational system.
Third, one skill is a bit harsh term and I wrongly used it. i don't know the exact word for it.

As far as child obuse goes... Any exploitation of children is a problem. Not 10, not 100, not 100000000. One is a problem. Period. Not signing the Rights of Child thing probably won't do any good, but at least, there is an idea and will to address this problem. By ignoring it, the problem won't go away on its own.

And a bit on socialism.
First. Do you know definition of socialism? Socialism is not and will never be a politcal regime. It is economical regime.
Second. Do you remember Yugoslavia? when we had totalitaristic regime with socialist economic orientation, we had 8000 (give or take 500) unemployed citizens (out of 20 000 000). Now, that democratic regime, with capitalist economic orientation is trendy here in Slovenia, we have 120 000 unemployed (out of 2 000 000).
Third. Just to make it clear, totalitarist regimes suck.
Fourth. Socialism is about well being of citizens. In Utopia, it would have been a world, where there would be no poor. No rich as well, but I don't think that many would have complained. However, world isn't perfect, and such system cannot exist.
Fifth. Countries that are still a bit socialist have free medical care for everyone (not just for those that can afford it), free education system, including college, pension for everyone that has been employed more than given amount of years.
Sixth. I don't think you are aware of it, buit the only countries in EU that had some sort of socialist regimes are: France (before WWI), Austria and Slovenia (partly; we had Titoism). Anyone thinking I've forgotten Czech Republic, Slovakia, Poland and other eastern block coutries, bare in mind that this were communist countires. So you can't exactly say, that Europe nations are socialist focused. However, they are aware of social problems. Which is entirely different term.
Germany never had socialism. Their unepmployment rate is a mixture of wrong migration politics, technological evolution and no future plan. Which is much like any other EU nation.

retired_huseyinek

Or its from their unhealthy love of David Hasselhoff?? :cool:

retired_babygirlgiggles

Our Chicaco poof might have made a valid point.

retired_lapepe

Crap, windows just ate another essay! Think I will write in notepad or something first from here on

True, but this can have quite severe consequences. As I understand, if the proposals goes through, big corporations can basically take control of the internet by pushing out small sites. Access times to sites that don't pay the big dought can increase, which means that freedom of speech is under threat as it operates today on the net. Right now the internet is a great resource for spreading information about all sorts of things. Personal webpages, small organisations and NGOs will pay. We all know that if we must wait several seconds for a site to launch, we quickly hit Back. This may well be the worst-case scenario, but if it does happen, it will have severe consequences. I think we can all agree that we don't get the info available on the internet through ads, TV or newspapers. Check www.savetheinternet.com for more info if interested. Oh, I see it got passed. Not surprising, but D'OH!!

No need for that, it was made that way by design. No surprise that it works as designed

Your theory makes sense, but I don't think it fits with reality. I think we have already concluded that both parties are to the right of center, at least in an international benchmark. The excuse that the US parties are to the right of center is usually put on the US public being to the right of center. But many polls tear this illusion apart. On many issues the US public disagrees with both the Dems and Reps. I think even on gun control they are in disagreement now. Then there is Kyoto, more central role for the UN, more social spending, higher minimum wage. The issues are many, these are just off the top of my head.

I think rather the reason is that both parties are strongly aligned with business interests, and parties tend to run to the right then. When there is no alternative to the left of center, the won't be punished for doing this, even if the US public is against their policies. That's why I think if the electoral system was made fairer - meaning abandoning the "first-past-the-post"-system - and allowing a 3rd party to appear in the presidential debates, it could gain momentum pretty fast.

Another problem with the US system is that the media is more or less non-working when it comes to analysing serious issues. And the political debate is higly personalized, and appears to be a lot of mud-throwing and smear-campaigning. Political ads in the media, especially on TV should be disallowed. That would hopefully lead to more serious debates about issues, instead of persons and their past.

I sort of agree. No empire in the history has been just bad, not the US either. Your example is something good the Napoleon Empire did. But I seem to remember some nasty stuff about it to. The Napoleonic Wars come to mind

The Brittish did horrible things in India for example, but they did spread English there, and build there railway system. These are important factors today for India's development. The Brittish of course built the railway system to transport troops around, but that's a different issue.

About the illiteracy rates. I did some research some months back about how well the US fared against OECD countries based onthe 2005 UNDP report. On surprisingly many fields they were dead last, on many points behind 3rd world countries as well. For instance the US has the most expensive health system in the world, and probably the most unfair in the West. Lifespan was way down on the list for instance.

About the Rights of the Child. There are many issues here that I can see doesn't correspond to US policy, but what perhaps stands out the most is the capital punishment of children. This is allowed in several US states,and the convention clearly states that capital punishment is not allowed against children.

Apparently the US is the only country in the world with a government that hasn't ratified it. Somalia hasn't either, but it's a "failed country" without a government, at least to my knowledge.

kov, I think I know what you mean with nach-idiotism. Capitalism meant that people had to specialize in order to fit into society. Instead of everybody doing and knowing basically all they needed to survive, we know have people that are specialists in one small field, and don't know sh!t about much else. Not wrong in itself, as it has allowed for a fantastic development in many fields, but when taken too far, it's not good.

This isn't the biggest gripe I have about the US education system. I think it's much worse that corporations are getting a more central role. Ads are put in books, and companies are used in the education itself, instead of neutral examples and so forth. Then there is the patriotic flag-waving exercise, and the religious introctrination, and still quite a bit of racism in the institutions. I think these are more serious issues than the specialization itself. To take one famous example, Creationism - or Intelligent Design as they have called it now. This has absolutely nothing to do with science, and has nothing to do in schools at all. Feel free to spread this crap in sunday-schools or bible-studies or whatever, but please keep it out of serious institutions.

To various degrees this is problems in the European education system too, but not as bad as in the US. I think there should be a complete separation between Church and state, and that religion shouldn't be tought in school. But as long as religion is in schools, there should at least be even teaching for all religions, not 90% christianity and 10% for the rest, which is the case here in Norway - which the UN has criticised us for by the way, and our former PM didn't give sh!t about. He should also be trialled for war crimes by the way, just as Bush should. Horrible men both of them. Religous extremism is never good, no matter what colour of their skin or name of religion. It is bad news.

retired_huseyinek

This is something that has bothered me for a long time. When me and my wife first moved here (her first time in America) it was right during the first Bush Election. She could not get over the smear campaigning that happens. She said that would never happen in England. I am sure it does, just not to the extent we do it. We also do it in everything. Comercials no-adays are nothing but smear campaigns aimed at another product instead of a person. "drink miller lite (crap ass beer) instead of the garbage beer bud lite(again crap beer).

www.savetheinternet.com
www.moveon.org

retired_jmeshew

It's getting too huge for quotes here so . . .

Hogie- yes, Texas is my home, but I am not pro-Bush in the way that many are. I think the guy has done some good, and some bad, and on the whole I am glad he is done after this term. As for a blinkered view- I can say the same about everyone who is popping off about stuff they don't know firsthand. My view is based on what I see every day, and what my life experience has been, just like anyone else. Regarding child's poverty, I wasn't taking a position on it, I was simply responding that the U.S. not signing that Child Rights resolution has little effect ,if any, on the rest of the world, which charge was made.

Kov- I guess it depends on how you define specialisation, but U.S. public school education is not highly specialized in terms of certain fields of study until college or vocational school which happens after high school. Every school district is a little different, thus, pre-University/Voc. school, you have some with a higher emphasis on science and math, others the liberal arts. There is no real blanket response I can make to this. For higher education, college degrees are specialized of course, and there is a trend to emphasize business and computer science, engineering, and other "practical" arts at the expense of liberal arts studies.I am still not quite sure what you are thinking about with this.
As for Socialism, yes I understand perfectly well what it is. I am talking praticality, not pure definition- a working term if you will. If it will make you happier, I will say socialist policies.I will also contend that western Europe are more socialist oriented than the U.S. I don't care whether they call themselves socialist, just by looking at the policies you can see the influence.

Pangea: how many U.S. schools have you visited lately? There is not one public school here that teaches Christianity, and thus far, efforts to introduce ID theory have not suceeded. In fact, if there is one thing that has been diligently watched and pursued in the courts, it's the separation of church and state here. Of course it's not a perfect separation, because people are people, and you know the story. But again, I have to say that you are making charges that do not seem to be based on first-hand knowledge. What are your sources for all these claims about the U.S. educational system?
As for the death penalty against children, some states did allow execution of 16 and 17 year olds convicted of capital murder, but the Supreme Court struck that down in 2005, so it's a non-issue at this point, though quite frankly if some 17 year old is man enough to rape and murder a woman, he's man enough to get gassed for it

retired_jmeshew

And yet you link to moveon.org, who have a long history of smearing republican and conservative candidates

retired_rwarner24

i just wanted to comment on the left/center/right of american politics.

the whole center, right, left skew of american politics is a joke. the democrats and republicans are so close is not even funny. their policies arent any different. not that ive ever been able to see anyway. its quite maddening. the people who identify themselves as liberal and conservative are, for the most part the same as well.

also, the media is not liberal or conservative. they exist to make money. period.

id love to post more on other specific points, but i just dont have time right now.

retired_mrsjb

The courts haven't been watching very well then. Off the top of my head:

1. Money. Bears the motto "In God We Trust". Added in the 50's. (I personally prefer one of the old mottos, "Mind your Business".)
2. The pledge of allegiance has the phrase "one nation under God". Added in the 50's
(both as a response to those damn Godless commies )
3. Government funding of faith-based charity. Bush's first act in office, 2001.
and so on...