Dayle Wood

I am considering devising the definitive training structure for youths in their formulative years to enable them to reach their potential as closely as possible.

To do that I need to rest on some basic fundimentals in the game, such as whether or not physical training is more important than technical training and if so to what proportion size.

Also what period of their footballing years is considered to be the youth training years.

If you break down those 'youth years' should emphasis on training be focussed on one thing over the other.

Should getting games be considered a priority over normal youth training and therefore placing more significance to loaning out as a tool in training the player more efficiently.

So before I set of on this voyage of discovery I'd like some views on what are the basic assumptions thus far that we hold to be true.

Please if you are the kind that is going to slate people for discussing tactics and trying to mock them please just don't comment in this thread. I'd prefer sensible enthusiastic dialogue than a thread that descends into name calling. Cheers.

Faisal Rakun

I find some youth players not happy if trained even in General (Youth) settings. So in my game, I created Reserves(Yth) for those youngsters who want little training (I find some players with Ambitious trait and/or low workrate may contribute to the cause). I also made Defenders, Midfielders, and Strikers, that's all.

I put the physical training (Aerobic and Strength) on 1st notch of medium. If I go any higher I get players injured every month or so).

Are you interested in talking about tutoring also?

Dayle Wood

I guess I'd like to touch on tutoring since it is an important tool if utilized properly.

As I understand tutoring There are three suggestions you can put to your youth once you identify a senior you wish to match them with:

1. senior seen as ideal role model for player

This is the hardest one to get a sucessful match for. It (I believe) attempts to teach the youth both the PPM's of the senior player an also some of their mental attributes.

2. adopting seniors approach to the game
This is easier than the first to get the youth gelling sucessfully with but the benefit of this is only mental attributes are improved.

3. learn from senior This teaches PPM only and is the easiest to suceed with.

Note: I may have got 2 and 3 the wrong way round so that will need clarification.

However in the road to giving your youngster the best possible start in life, you can see already that tutoring has benefits that are worth pursuing.

Faisal Rakun

Regarding tutoring, there are some observation that I have done.

- Tutoring also adds some positional play, for example my Klose (AMC competent /ST) tutors pekhart, then pekhart (ST) got AMC Unconvincing.

- It is hardest to have Born Leader/Leader as your tutor, so far none have been succesfull (Puyol or Ronaldinho trying to tutor youth with personality other than Balanced)

- It is best to use Ideal Role Model if the young have balanced, so he is easier to be told to be thus.

- You can tutor left footed player with right footed one.

Dayle Wood

Thanks mate. The main thing I take from what you say, other than the good tips, is that player personality also comes into question with tutoring.

Therefore is might be worth getting a list of the types and figureing out which ones compliment others.

Here are ones I can think of of the top of my head:

Resolute, balanced, determined, leader, professional, fairly professional, model professional,

So matching these with other compatible personalities seems important. If anyone has a sucessful link for ideal role model option then it would be interesting to know what the two personality types were (homework there for us! ).

Also Faisal can you remember which option of the three you had Klose and Pekhart using? Then we could add the positional observation you made to that option as a known benefit.

Dayle Wood

New Youths Promoted

Whenever the club brings new yoth to the club the ass man will make a comment about the best player in that batch. Below is how you should interpret that:


- "One of the better players this year." (he will never make the 1st team)

- "One of the best players to come through the ranks in recent years." (he should have a good PA and could become a really good player)

- "Could be one of the best players of his generation" (if he is given correct training he will be a world class player)

joebailey

I think this is going to be a very useful thread as I know must people (including myself) list bringing youngsters through the ranks to greatness as one of the most enjoyable features in the game.

Unfortunately, I have more questions than opinions and facts on the matter! The main things I would like to know.......

1) Is it more benificial for your player to go on loan to a medium club with average training or stay at yours with top coaches and facilities. I know a lot of people have their own views but is there any definitive evidence?

2) Can youngsters suffer from burn out? If you play a 17 or 18 year old week in week out with only the odd game rested, will this harm his development?

3) You have devised a training schedule for your young star concentrating on the areas you want him to improve in. Now, can you keep this forever or should you change his schedule around? What I'm really asking here is does a player have PA for each attribute or can I get his finishing up by 2 if his tackling goes down 2? This is the thing I would be most keen to hear people's thoughts on.

A couple of my own views. I find it much more beneficial to train players in technical and tactical attributes. Physical attributes dont change too dramatically over the years. If you trained Rick Waller at Man Utd for 2 years would he become an Olympic runner? I think not. Therefore, if the position requires good physcial stats, it is best to look for youngsters who have these alreday and then improve them elsewhere.

If you can find the right match.......tutoring is VERY effective. I have had a few players increase drastically during a tutoring period. I tend to find if you use a big name star who is well respected in your team and throughout football, then regardless of personalities, it will work.

Dayle Wood

Joebailey - question 1 - I think the ideal situation (and I'm prepared to be told otherwise by higher powers) is keeping them at your own club with your (hopefully) excellent facilities BUT they must get a little first team experience otherwise sending them to a club that says they will be a valuable member of the team is probably the better alternative.

How much first team football? I'd say that depends on a few factors such as their stamina and condition. I wouldn't start a player under 95% as a general rule and I think this is even more important for youths otherwise it becomes detrimental and burnout ensues - which I guess answers your second question.

The good thing is that youths don't complain about lack of first team football as a general rule. THey are happy to get any time on the park so you are able to slot them in at your leisure.

Your third question - PA is an all encompassing number. It is for all attributes and when it goes up the increase in attributes is distributed according to a system I don't know bugger all about.

I kind of disagree with you on the physical training point you raise. PLayers at a young age are still developing physically so I think it makes sense that physical training is important to assist developing it as much as possible.

The question is what should the mix between physical and technical be for youths. Answer that with any certainty and the battle is halfway won.

Cheers for your comments.

DirtyACE

Here are some things I've noticed in my game:

Regarding tutoring:
I always use the third option (the easiest one) and I have noticed that two of my younger players have picked up certain prefered moves. For example I have a young striker being tutored by Eto'o. That striker now likes to round the keeper, get into channels, and beat the offside trap, just like his tutor.

I also have a young defender who is being tutored by Marques. He now likes to play his way out of trouble, dive into tackles, and something else that I don't remember.

In any case, I think tutoring is pretty effective overall, although I did have a case where a player just didn't get along with his tutor and broke it off. I think their personalities were incompatible.

Dayle Wood

Tips regarding sending players out on loan

1. Try to ensure the club they are going to has training facilities that meet you approval.

2. Make sure the club promise your player will be a valuable member of the team. (no point sending him somewhere to sit on a bench).

3. If he is your third choice player for a position on your first team make sure he can 'be recalled' if you succumb to an injury crisis.

4. Make sure the league he will be loaned to is of a suitable difficulty for your player (not too easy or hard).

more to be added as I or others bring to light.