retired_lehigh

J-beth: I don't use man marking, I use tight zonal. And yeah, I expected my streak to come to an end, but not against at home the weakest team in the league...

retired_slayerbing

Ah the old xmas tree formation. IT all makes sense.

Well mate. Slow tempo, attacking mentality high closing down for your midfield, lots of forward runs lots of creativity.

That formation (the xmas tree) is very defensive in nature and is counter attacking. Your tactic was too attacking and not patient enough, hence why you needed to slow things down and take your time.

I'm not suprised they beat you now.

Anyway think of that tactic as you would a flat 442. It is defensive counter attacking by the ai, and as I've said if you just attack with fast tempo they will destroy you - not always but certainly it explains what happened.

retired_lehigh

Dayle Wood: Thx, then I know what I should do next time. I haven't faced that tactic very often, I guess that's what the AI does when it's most likely it will lose?

retired_slayerbing

Not so much lose but certainly they fear you and have set their stall out to blunt your attack. They are counting on you committing your team forward and throwing your self at their wall.

The answer is to be more patient, keep the ball and look for quality chances - hence a slower tempo with your attacking players getting forward.

Close them down more, use a higher defensive line so they are under pressure all the time with no space to play.

If you have a good goalkeeper with closing down get him to play as a sweeper keeper if they try and lob the ball over.

retired_lehigh

Thx for the info. I think I'm getting some of the thoughts around the tweeking tactic thingy, but something are still a bit akward for me....

retired_slayerbing

such as?

retired_slayerbing

Hey mate - there is a thread here by wwfan which might give you some insights on how to play against certain formations...


http://community.sigames.com/eve/for...7/m/9572038913

I relied on the theory in there and have used it to good effect (the first post in particular). Hope it helps.

retired_lehigh

I have read the thread before, a great read, but it need some time to try it out before it becomes a part of "thinking FM style"... But I finally get the general idea. I just have some minor problems understanding _when_ the AI does it's minor changes which I need to counter in order to win. I still have managed to be somewhat successfull in the game, but I felt I was lacking some of the understanding of the match engine.

I've been playing FM/CM since CM93/94 came out, but this is the first time I have had this much "problems" winning as much. I think to some degree the AI is a bit too complicated for a game, but it's a challenge anyway and I can't say no to a challenge. FM07 is the first game where I have been close to throwing my comp out the window in frustration, although I have had some minor tilts in the previous versions none have been as frustrating as this.

But all in all, this has at the same time been the most entertaining version. Where I have ran around the livingroom cheering as I have won a major turnament in extratime. Anyway, I rable now.

The main thing I need to understand now is how to indentify AI changes and how to counter them. I have gotten this to some degree, but not completely. Ah well, back to trying to win the Northern Irish Premiership with Clough Rangers. :cool:

retired_slayerbing

Well the way to identify changes within the game is fairly easy (in my opinion).

I go generally by the following pattern:

1. At the start of the match I look at their formation and decide whether I have set my tactic up to play against it effectively.
If they are playing a flat 442 for example (or indeed the dreaded xmas tree) I will play my more patient controlling tactic. etc etc

2. After 10 minutes of play I make a decision based on the early information coming in. That decision is based on possession, shots on target, general gameplay as I'm watching and passing percentage.
If it is all going my way I will stay with what I am doing and continue monitoring things till halftime.

If I am not happy I will tweak or change my tactic to ensure I am winning possession and dominating etc.

Times to change:

1. If I am seriously behind in possession.
2. If I go 2 goals behind in quick sucession.
3. when they go to a 4-2-4 (usually from the 80th minute on but as early as 70min).


Bear in mind much like wwfan I have set up 6 tactics based on the formtaion I use. If I feel things are not going well I change 'up' or 'down' on those tactics scale depending on what I want to acheive.

SO for example:

1. Allout attack (my own 424)
2. Normal attack (my home based attack) - faster tempo less caution.
3. My control tactic - used at home, slower tempo but still attacking.
4. Myaway possession tactic - attacking but lower defensive line and can soak up more attacks than the contol tactic (my starting tactic away usually)
5. My defensive counter attacking tactic - when the likes of chelsea or Arsenal goe on the rampage I resort to this. Also use this at home against the 424.
6. My sht up shop tactic vs the 424 away.


I move up and down these tactics as I need to in a match. Usually one change up or down is sufficient to restore any loss of contol in the match.

retired_lehigh

Hmmm....I have only used 3 different tactics, time to change!

The ones I have used are all flat 4-4-2 with different instructions individually and globally.

The main one is the home tactic. A quick, wide and attacking tactic with high defenceline. The fullbacks have mixed crossing and fwr(To not leave much space for a counter). One of the center mids are attacking and one defencive. The wingers have attacking mentality, and cross from byline. This is the general hometactic and if I am a big favoritte to win away.

The second one is a medium attack formation. Medium pace, medium width and medium defenceline. The wingers are a bit more defencive, as is the fullback. This is my common awaytactic unless I'm meeting a far supperior team. I also use this against better teams at home. I also use much closing down on my defmid and wingers.

The third is the defencive counter. Slow, narrow and a low defenceline. This is for tough awaymatches and against 4-2-4(quite successfully). Both centermids are defencive(I usually have a sub suited for the possition). Both have high closing down, as well as wingers forward and fullbacks(To stop crosses begin accurate).

I guess it's time to make a control tactic and a possesion tactic. I'll take a quick look at wwfans thread again!