arman920

I see and sympathise with most of what you are saying.

You should consider retracting that bit though, It's totally untrue and shows that you have no concept of how FM is tested and why it is tested as it is.

Unfortunately it's not my place to explain it to you, I'd appreciate SI doing so but I can see good reasons why they might choose not to.

Let me add that I've yet to see a significant problem that wasn't picked up by testers, as Paul C has explained by the time we get the game in a form which enables us to pick up these things it's alreadt too late to fix them before release.

In the case of the beta patch it doesn't take a mathemetician to work out how long we had it on test for.

Please understand it can be as frustrating for us as it is for you, the only difference is that we generally know the constraints SI work under and therefore understand better why the status quo exists.

retired_laurag

I see and sympathise with most of what you are saying.

You should consider retracting that bit though, It's totally untrue and shows that you have no concept of how FM is tested and why it is tested as it is.

Unfortunately it's not my place to explain it to you, I'd appreciate SI doing so but I can see good reasons why they might choose not to.

Let me add that I've yet to see a significant problem that wasn't picked up by testers, as Paul C has explained by the time we get the game in a form which enables us to pick up these things it's alreadt too late to fix them before release.

In the case of the beta patch it doesn't take a mathemetician to work out how long we had it on test for.

Please understand it can be as frustrating for us as it is for you, the only difference is that we generally know the constraints SI work under and therefore understand better why the status quo exists. </BLOCKQUOTE>

Kriss, I know some of my comments above arn't going to make me popular with those that test. Its just some issues that show up are so obvious. I have to say as I have above that this was the best out the box FM for years, I can't understand why people said it was not playable, and there is a very good tactical way to get around the closing down issue as well which I did.

The Beta patch was in my opinion a good idea, if all the issues that people raise are sorted before the official patch is released. How about next years game giving you the option to install a test folder, like two folders of the game on one computer, SI games can release these Beta patches and you can test them on the test version of the install and send a report back. I know I be happy to do so to help any patches and sorting of issues.

It is hard for all and i'm very grateful that SI games offer a forum that allows you to talk to them, instead of employing mods to run out the corporate line and ignore the issues. Maybe they are a victim with some of the stick they get on here by the fact they are so accessible. Its just some of the bugs and issues released on the games first release should be picked up if tested, and for some really bad ones to slip through year after year and then have poeple on here get annoyed about people asking for patches is wrong. Your right I don't know how they test their product, I go on guess's and what people have said, but as I said above I remember a post last year when they said they may have to review the testing process and I think for the sake of a alot of loyal fans that needs to be the case. If I have to wait longer than 12months for a new version to come out so it can be be tested throughly, instead of getting one every 12months and waste 2-3 months disinchanted with all the issues, I know which option I would take!

allegra

This is the biggest outcry I've seen after a release by SI in a fair few years IMO. I don't mean your rant personally, I mean generally.

Now while we can and probably should be sympathetic towards SI and the pressures and constraints placed upon them from above, to release the game in the state it was and is still, is unforgivable.

It actually pains me to see the state of current affairs, what with a beta patch and almost desperation like measures.

Or maybe I just don't know what I'm talking about...

retired_Balanchinegal

Perhaps it's just not possible to bring out a game that actually works...
I don't understand why SI didn't just take FM07, update all player transfers and attributes, management movements and new Chairmen and what-have-we, and then fix all the problems that were remaining from that game (and there was a lot).
Why start all over from scratch? From what I'm reading here (I never got FM08 yet) FM08 is just a bug infested mess, almost unworthy of playing and it's gonna take a hell of a lot of work to fix it, if they ever do....
Why not just iron out all the problems from the last installment?
Would have saved a lot of work, money and grief.
And would have pleased a lot of players.
I bet if you run that idea over the members on this forum, the majority would agree,
Not that it'll ever happen, mind.

Emm

Reading between the lines, it seems that although we, (certainly me), are critical of the testing team, in terms of what is and isn't slipping through the testing process, the problem may lie more at the door of the people that the testers report to.

It's all well and good a tester finding a bug and reporting it, yet until it is actually fixed, the jobs not really done. Testers only look as good as the programmers who write the fixes to the problems that the testers find. We just see the bugs so assume that the testers have missed things.

In reality, I think what is happening is that most of the bugs that we are finding, have already been found and reported by the testing team, but SI were unable to work in a fix for whatever reason.

This leaves the likes of you and me finding bugs, posting about bugs, and thinking what the hell have the tsting team been doing? I think I've already upset at least one tester with my comments in other threads and I think this has more to do with me laying the blame for "bugs", squarely at the feet of the testing team. Spending time in the bugs forum has been quite eye-opening and I have seen the testing team acknowledge bugs as "known" almost as soon as they are posted.

The game was out on x date and the beta patch was out on x date + 6. We're now at x date + 9 and if you just do the maths it really doesn't give the boys that much time to either find issues within the game, or more importantly crate the fixes for the issues that have been found.

I'm really disappointed with the the lower league attendace issue that impacts enormously upon lower league finances and really does make the game unplayable long term for me. I hope though that this might be looked at for the finalk patch.

Of similar concern is the increase in the rate at which goals seem to flying in following the introduction of the patch. I suppose it's a whole different game now, but some of the scores I've seen posted are simply ridiculous.

I haven't a clue what the testing set up is like in terms of when they get what and what deadlines etc are in place, but it would seem that it hasn't worked as well this year as it has in the past. I know this isn't even all SI's fault. Last year thay did a Beta test and it was leaked almost immediately, so the way I look at it, we were testing the beta test for the first week after the game was out. Then we were testing the normal game after the beta patch and now it is as if we are just looking at the full game for the first time.

I don't mind most of the time, it's just gets frustrating when you post bugs in the forum and you see the guys in there doing their best to get to the bottom of it, but I honetly get the feeling that I'm wasting my time and nothing I find or post about will make much of a difference.

An example of this is that after every goal that a GK scores, it states in the commentary that this is his first goal of the season. I reported it this year. I reported it after FM07 was released. I reported it after FM06 was released and I reported it after FM05 was released. I'm not 100% positive, but I think I mentioned it when CM03/04 was released too. If something as basic as that can't get sorted then what hope is there of some of the in depth match engine stuff .

retired_B_RAN

Is this some sort of a JOKE?! The testers are receiving the game AFTER it's already set for release, and there is no time available to report any problems before it's too late?

If this is the case, then this should be made a sticky at the top of these forums, and SI should be absolutely and utterly ashamed of itself. No wonder there was a massive closing down bug in the initial release, and no wonder the beta patch is awful!

retired_Balanchinegal

Is this some sort of a JOKE?! The testers are receiving the game AFTER it's already set for release, and there is no time available to report any problems before it's too late?

If this is the case, then this should be made a sticky at the top of these forums, and SI should be absolutely and utterly ashamed of itself. No wonder there was a massive closing down bug in the initial release, and no wonder the beta patch is awful! </BLOCKQUOTE>

Dito :thup:

arman920

All I will add is that while I fully understand your views, I don't think there is a simplistic solution.
I'm a bit surprised at the outrage expressed, you have to know what limitations exist and why to make a balanced judgement.

It's good to see so many people rationalising about it though, being insulting to SI or the people who test the game doesn't get you any closer to a solution. Talking about it might.

retired_matador_uk

DISGUSTED with SI about this. Totally sick of all the excuses. My question to you guys at SI is. While you programme this game do YOU test it! I am responsible for my work when i do it. I dont have someone testing everything for me. Why is it that testing teams get the blame when programmers are the ones that create the problem.

I simply do not believe that these things were not picked up by the programmers. Forget about the testers guys. When a chef makes a bad meal do you blame the other people who ordered it. NO NO NO! The creater of the problem is to blame. Unless of corse you guys at SI dont play this game. Very hard to get right yes. But how do so many totally unbelievable things get past your notice.

Ball watching is a curse and a blight upon this game, and you have done NOTHING about ti for 3 versions. You have had way to many chances SI. It's not improving its getting worse and now the comps go crazy. I will be dwnloading the new patch when available. But I will say this, after three versions of the same crap. If the patch doesnt make the game near on perfect, that will do me. Good luck SI you have a task ahead of you. The community is waiting. Dont screw upo again.

retired_luckystrike

Do you have the pirated version?