retired_abess

Try reading the bugs forum and maybe you would notice that I created a topic for the bug ONE WEEK AGO, and it now contains countless postings from people with the same problem. We've uploaded saved games, and one tester claims that it has been confirmed and forwarded to the development team. Yet there has been NOTHING posted from the development team. It hasn't been added to the known issues list either, even though it's being a crippling, game-stopping bug from the very moment that a saved game begins.

You've had confirmation it's on the to do list. What more do you want? A big kiss? Here XXXXXXX

Stop making assumptions without actually checking my postings.

Now you're expecting me to run around checking your posting history. The world doesn't revolve around you chum. You've posted the bug, it's been acknowledged. Move along!

I've done my part to report the bug and provide extensive proof of it, as have many others. When will SI do its part and actually acknowledge it and give us assurances that it will be fixed?

Sometime, maybe, never. Let them get on with building the patch instead of whipping up a fuss about nowt.

For the record, I played CM4 and beta tested for some of the enhancement packs. That game did not have two colossal bugs that rendered the game unplayable for me. FM08 is the first version of this series that I actually stopped playing soon after it was released. Never before have I seen something like the closing down bug and the morale bug in FM08.

In my opinion, closing down is still not fixed, because the game still fails to implement the slider settings the way that it did in FM07. Players still do not follow the closing down instructions consistently, even when they are given virtually no creative freedom. Closing down was perfect in FM07. Why was this tampered with and ruined?

As I said, there has not been any response from the development team regarding the morale bug. I played CM4 from the moment it was released, and I enjoyed the game even during the trying times of the enhancement packs. I have not played FM08 since the day after I received it. I played for one day before the beta patch and for one day afterwards. That's the difference. FM08 is unenjoyable for me, whereas CM4 was something I could enjoy despite its many initial flaws.

As for being constructive, I've already done that in the bugs forum. Beyond that, who can be constructive when you can't enjoy the game you just paid for and that you were anticipating with such joy? For the most part, it's the only PC game that I can be bothered to play, so a lot more is riding on this than there is for the average person. THAT is why I get so upset about this, but SI should be thankful that I feel that way. It's the people who care passionately about this game that have made it a success.

OK, I've been a little flippant so far, but in my defence it is awfully late/early, and I've been here pretty much all day. But seriously, just have some faith in the developers who've never let us down before. Why would they start doing so now? Don't get mad that the bugs might not get fixed. Get mad when they haven't been. And I'll come and get mad with you. IF that happens. And it won't.



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arman920

Jimbo, seems to me you're misinterpreting for the sake of an argument.

I've stated what I think is likely in the future and that I personally can live with that.

I also stated that if your expectations are higher you should use the proper means to persuade SI to try meeting them.

There's no contradiction there.

What I don't say is what will happen because I don't know, my idea was to encourage people to continue the debate on improving the status quo, even if some of their expectations are unachievable.

Emm

So let me get this right.

I suggest that we should lower our expectations.

You disagree with me, (surprise surprise), and tell me that we should retain our expectations and push SI to realise them.

Then you tell me that, (in your opinion), every release of FM will need patching and that it should come with a "patch statement".

So you want me to keep unrealistic high expectations, that have never been met in the past, and in your opinion will never be met in the future !

And I'm "misinterpreting for the sake of an argument".

ROFL .

retired_rymar

Major Raver - this thread is fine. I (and the SI lads) get extremely bored of people who relentlessly blame testers without reading threads like this. Also - I've never had an issue with any constructive criticism of the game and have no issues with people voicing any view they like on the forums - provided its considered and constructive. If that wasn't clear before, I hope it is now.

Greg - categorically, SI read ALL the threads in the bug forum. They have people employed to do exactly that.

retired_2symonds

The bugs forum isn't there for the development team to give feedback. It's there for issues to be reported and our QA guys to gather the relevant information and report it in our bug tracking system. Whoever receives the bug probably won't even know there is a thread about it in the bugs forum.

All they need is a bug report with the relevant saved games and whatever other information is needed.

If they had to respond to every topic in the bugs forum then it would dramatically decrease their workrate. That is what our QA team are there for. And from looking at the thread you have had a reply from at least two of them off the top of my head.

retired_laurag

I also can't stand the "this game is rubbish" threads myself, or "the game is unplayable". In the same way I ain't no fan of the "this game is brilliant and anyone that says otherwise is a moron" threads! All are very unhelpful.

I don't expect a response from SI to the points raised, its good enough for me that they are at least listening to the views of those who buy, and again it isn't important that when they do read them they agree, just have an open mind that people are trying to help with constructive comments, and i'm sure they do.

Been a good discussion in here guys, bar the odd prat, and I for one have got a better understanding of what has been going on!

retired_B_RAN

No, I'm expecting you not to make wild accusations or baseless statements about a poster unless you're willing to check your facts first.

Good question, Serpico. Why WOULD the developers start letting us down by releasing an unfinished game and then creating a NEW, colossal bug with the beta patch? I disagree respectfully with your stance about getting mad. We have every right to be mad RIGHT NOW, about the very existence of these bugs.

The faith has already been lost, my friend. Have you noticed the countless posts in recent years from people who now wait to buy the game until weeks after it's released? Have you noticed how many people now assume that new releases will have massive flaws and will be unplayable until at least a patch or two? I think a lot of people have lost faith in the quality assurance for initial releases, and it's lucky for SI they still have faith in the game overall.

The trouble is that there are too many apologists who won't get mad with us NOW, even though we have every reason to be upset. Instead, everyone keeps telling people to wait around and have faith, all while many of us cannot play the game, because the morale bug is so pervasive and serious that it affects every aspect of the saved game from the moment you create a new one.

Once again I will state that it's the people who push the hardest, complain the loudest, and feel both the greatest joy and the greatest anger that have made this game great. That is why I have been tireless and harsh with my criticism when it needs to be. And that is why I'm positive and constructive when people need help with tactics, with enabling nations for management, with alleged "superkeepers" and all the rest. I want to help people get joy out of the game.

Just think of it in terms of an FM team talk. Sometimes you have to let the squad know that its performance is totally unacceptable. That's what people are doing right now with this release and beta patch.

Down the road, when the squad brings up its level of play and starts delivering the expected results, then we can declare that we're pleased or delighted. But right now the team needs to admit its faults and accept the criticism as valid. If some members of the squad can't handle the criticism or aren't willing to turn around the results, then they should be transfer listed.

Lasek808

Please can Everyone, calm down, calm down. We all want the patch to be out a.s.a.p. so we can enjoy a great game better. The guys at SI are working as hard as they can to make this happen and it's useless to try and pry when will it be out, because it is totally out of our hands. They will release it when it is finished and that's fair enough. In the meanwhile, let's try instead to "test" the game and give the guys at SI some constructive feedback on the game, report possible new bugs and data issues that we find. That is the best thing we can do to help them! Let's work together and the result will be better! Lets get together and help them, and please stop moaning.

retired_janelletorres

It comes down to this. There's a fear that the patch will not fix the game and yet people have already parted with their money.

One patch has already been released, and the game is still very unrealistic in parts. What if the next patch is not good enough, wait a month for another patch? It's really not good enough is it?

We'll just have to wait and see. The FM07 patch worked a treat.

I think serious connoisseurs of the FM franchise want to play a realistic game, and they shout the loudest. You also have a lot of pick up and play people who don't really seem to care if their team loses 11-1 or they win 8-1, 6-0, 7-2 etc. etc. as long as they win.

I suppose it's down to what you want from the game. I want realism, as I devote a lot of time to setting up the game, and it's a sim after all. Without realism, there is no game as far as I'm concerned. I think if they fail to patch it properly I simply will turn my back on the franchise for good, and a lot of other people will just give up on it, but by and large I trust SI as they have always delivered a good patch in the end. Let's hope that patch comes sooner rather than later. I'd rather they not rush it, just get it right.

retired_stoupaki

I have a question, once you install the patch and start up a new game, will there be an 8.0.1 datebase to chose from or is it still the 8.0.0 datebase but the fixes are there?