retired_mugdozer

Just another massive thank you for the talkfootball.co.uk link!
and one more small question about statistics? just to get a ballpark baseline.

What would be considered (for a team) a lot of shots? an avg amt of shot? I understand it will depend on the formation, styles of play etc, but just average it all out?

goals/assists for individuals? what would a high end or a good season be? a historical type season?

Finally, for team passing, what is a good range to be in, 75%+?

It's hard to try to evaluate a team with no basis for what's considered good, bad or average!

Thanks again!

retired_venomm

I'd say something that would really help you to into the game quicker would be to take a little more interest in real life football, get an RSS feed from somewhere like skysports.com or something and just read up on some of the goings on and watch some videos - even things like post match analysis (if they are online somewhere) will help you out as comments are made about how and why a player is doing well or poorly in their position, discussions on manager decisions and questioning them, where teams are strong and weak and why - which is all knowledge you can take into the game. FM is trying to be a simulation of real life, so the more you understand about the real life world of football, the easier the game is to pick up and play in my opinion.

Naturally there are some things in games you won't find being discussed in this sort of thing, such as training and manager/player interaction for example - but...

...you have a good and very helpful mentor there (and a rather obsessive one) that I am sure will point you in the right direction - and it won't be long before you're creating complex tactics, telling everyone to use notes in game, suggestiong possible improvements to SI and starting a one man campaign to get everyone writing in FM Stories

retired_w0lfpack1

Um, I tend to see shots range from 1 to 20+ for a single match; I always feel like I'm doing well if I've gotten 10 or more, maybe 6 or more "on target", and frustrated if we've taken 6 or fewer shots in a game.

Goals for individuals is typically measured as "goals per game", and 1 goal every 2 games is phenomenal for a striker at the highest levels. At lower levels you may see a dominant player bang in a goal a game, but he really belongs further up the ladder. 1 goal every 3 is more likely. 20+ will be a very good season, equivalent to say 40 home runs.

Team passing.. not sure, and does vary a lot by level (as higher quality players are much more likely to string three passes together in succession). I'm typically looking for "more than my opposition".

retired_w0lfpack1

LMAO @ paulsgruff.

Wha', who, ME?

**best innocent grin**

retired_mugdozer

curses! so much for traveling incognito!

retired_mugdozer

paulsgruff,

Actually, thanks to DV, I've got 2 24 hour football (see, I'm not barbaric enough to call it soccer here! <G>, now if only I can slip in a "whilst" here and there, I'll be mistaken for a wily vet!) channels that I've been watching more and more. The problem I find is that most broadcasts and announcers take for granted that most of the intricacies are common knowledge. True enough most places, just not for us heathen colonials!

I like your idea for post match analysis alot, although I'd have to try to find one for a game that I can watch.

Just like other sports, you get a totally different picture of a game when you're there as opposed to on TV, since on TV they tend to follow the ball, but when you're there you can pay close attention to the big picture and pick a position to watch and see how they react to different situations.

That'll be the hardest part for me, I believe, picking up the intricacies of the game. The big strategy should be relatively easy, and I'll also have to get into the proper frame of mind, coming from an ice hockey background, with a smaller surface, much more offense and unlimited substitutions. Oh, and a lot more ice!

retired_kellyk

Hello sposfan,

When it comes to shots it depends not the number but the quality. You can generate 20 shots on goal, but if these are from distance and are 'long shots' then its a desperate attempt and a sure sign that you are not getting penetration. Ideally you want to be looking at goals/shots on target. This is a better measure. Try and keep the ratio as low as possible and you will know that you are doing well. 70-80% is a good target to aim for and it means you are very dangerous. Total shots in my opinion is not a good measure

Another thing you want to be looking at is Action Zones, these are graphical representations of possession by pitch area. The pitch is divided into 3 boxes, defense, midfield and offense. When you have high possession % as depicted in your match stats screen you will want to refer to Action Zones to see where these are predominantly occurring in. I have seen people get as high as 60% possession, but they don't score. When they look at the Action Zones they discover their possession is mainly in defense and midfield. The goal here is to try and be good overall or to dominate midfield outright and offense. There is more in the sticky in the tactics forum that should really help you its called the FAQ.

When it comes to goals and assists, it really depends on the kind of formation you have. If you know you want to create a tactic which is dependant on goals coming from the flanks then you want good assists from the wingers. This will be the first sign that your tactic is coming together. I personally like tactics to have 3 main ways of scoring. Through the flanks, from midfield and from set-pieces. So I generally aim to get good assists in all areas. Depending on the level you play, 20 goals a season from a striker is a must if you want to be considered a contender.

For team passing, it all depends on your style of play. A counter attacking formation generates lower passing percentages then a slow probing formation. You need to decide on what kind of formations you want to have and then you should use passing % to see how close to the mark you are:

In general:

Slow passing probing possession : 80% passing
Counterattacking: 70-75%
Defensive football: 75% passing

There is a basis to determine if a side is good or bad. If you are looking at just measuring how your players stack up its covered in the FAQ. In general you want to look at attributes and what the league average is. For instance in the premiership or any topflight league, you want passing for top playmakers to be at least 15. Key attributes for key positions need to be around 15...and then these get lower for different leagues...

hope that helps

retired_mugdozer

Rashidi,


Thank you for the welcome and it does!


Paulsgruff... sorry, can't edit posts, meant dTv (directv)

retired_venomm

You're lucky, I never get to see hockey games because of the time they are usually on TV here and how it unbelievably always seems to coincide perfectly with when I am at work (I'm a penguins fan, they're doing okay at the moment too!)

In my opinion the intricacies are quite well dealt with in FM. I can see where you're coming from though about how TV portrays the game and the amount of action and important events that happen off screen and how it could hinder learning what makes a player good for the positions he plays in.

The nice thing about FM is that the attributes are very easy to understand - you could literally look up a dictionary definition of most and know instantly how it would relate to what they make the player be able to do - and once you know from real life experience what is important for a player to be able to play his role effectively - then it's just a fair bit of common sense that comes into realising which attributes go hand in hand and will make him suitable for his job. For example, a defender that has terrible attributes for scoring goals shouldn't worry you, but if he can't tackle and doesn't regularly get his positioning or decisions right then you might find him making more mistakes than you are willing to put up with.

Another great and not often mentioned thing about FM is that it is as deep as you want it to be, if you want to get involved in all the tactics, control the reserves and the youth team and do all of the media interaction while juggling your budgets around - then you are free to. Then again, if you just want to sign players and let someone else do all the work then you can holiday the matches and let your assistant manager play them for you etc - there are so many variations of style, even if you asked everyone in this thread how they play the game, most people are almost always going to be different - which is one of the reasons that it can be so interesting talking to people just starting out and trying to learn about it.

Back on topic, tactics are naturally extremely important (if you plan on playing the matches yourself) and are hard to cover simply. One of the great things about football is that any team, no matter how big or small, can potentially beat another team as the starting conditions for both is always the same and there is no handicap involved - which means that it can often come down to tactical decisions (and of course some luck). Instead of trying to explain anything here, I will leave it to people that have already done it, and done it far better than I would have been able to do. I didn't check through all the links in the posts in this thread, so sorry if this has already been posted, but there are some very informative threads in the tactics forum. The one I would always recommend that people take a look at is this one by wwfan. I would say that, for a beginner, it is far more useful as an information source than a tactics reference book would be as it explains things in terms that are relative to the games match engine and gives you an insight into how to get players to do what you want them to do in game. Some of the information may be outdated with the newly improved AI, but the theory is technically still the same, just how it is applied may be slightly different now.

retired_mugdozer

Paulsgruff,

Thank you for the link, I had not seen that one previously. Going to have to replace that ink cartridge soon at this rate!

For everyone else...

seeing as how my football knowledge pretty much stagnated in the 80's, is there a particular reason for the demise of the sweeper? For those knowledgeable about US football, I see him almost as a free safety, able to move freely to where the point of attack is. I would guess that Obviously something happened to counter what effectiveness he had, but is it really countered or is it more a matter of a few successful teams moved away from using a sweeper and the other teams just followed the leaders?

Going to be a big penguins/montreal game this weekend, if you send me an email to sposfanATsympaticoDOTca, I can record it to our vhs and mail it to you. No dvd burner for the tv yet unfortunately, but you can always have it transferred to the system of your choice.

Elan