stokes_83

Can anyone answer this for me?

When Arsenal uses a 5-4-1 formation in Europe, do they use it in an attacking sense with only 1 DM and wingers being pushed into the attacking zone?

Or do they use it in a defensive formation with 2 DM, and a CM,LM,RM?


I have had terrible luck with the 5-4-1 formation and always end up going back to 4-2-2. I am not totally sure what the issue is but I think it may be because I am too offensive.

r0x0r

For a start, we use a 4-5-1 at times, but never a 5-4-1.

Secondly, we play with one "defensive" midfielder in the five (gilberto), however he plays in a MC position, but with a more defensive mentality. Equally, one of the "attacking" midfielders (cesc) plays a CM role next to the defensive midfielder.

To understand the swap, think of it this way.

Set up an Arsenal 4-4-2, flat middle but arguably a farrow/barrow on the MC's... certainly different mentalities and instructions. Ontop of this, pull one of the FC's back into the AMC spot. That's an Arsenal 4-5-1.

stokes_83

Are you sure? The BIGD Arsenal post above has a slightly different configuration.

Gilberto is not a first team regular in recent weeks. Flamini has been the choice instead.

In the BIGD post, and I think it is correct, it shows only 1 player in a forward position, 4 across the middle, and Flamini in a DM role.

I cannot generate offense against the better teams from this setup. I am wondering if it is tactics, or if the setup itself is too defensive to expect offense from.

janssm

I've not read the BIGD formation thread, but if you want to generate some offense with this sort of tactic I would assume (feel free to correct me) quite a high D-line, which is completely feasible seeing as Clichy/Gallas/Toure/Sagna are probably as fast a back line as you'll see in this game. Playing at a slower tempo will see more of your players get involved in the play, and although Arsenal have become famous for their lightning quick thrusts, the success they had with the 4-5-1 was mostly due to a patient build up, which coupled with a narrow width sees plenty of players get involved in the play.

If I was to play the 4-5-1 I would line up with a DMC behind a flat middle 4, short forward arrows on the wingers, and change the personnel in the middle depending on if you want to attack or defend. You should have plenty of options, and for an attacking line up I would use van Persie on the left, Fabregas and Rosicky centrally with Gilberto behind them, and Hleb on the right, Eduardo or Adebayor upfront.

If you follow a RoO mentality system, say something like DC's 14, FB's 15, DM 16, MC's 17, W's 18, FC 19 (or 15, depending on how you want him to play) and play with a high D-line, passing in the short range, low tempo and narrow width you should see plenty of nice triangular play with wingers pulling in and out, or thats what I'm experiencing with my Hertha Berlin side atm anyway.

Thats the best advice I can give, hope some of it helps you.

Personally I would be using a 4-4-2 with Arsenal though, defense is more than solid enough for this, especially coupled with the defensive cover a player like Gilberto provides in the middle. (Yes I know he's not a regular irl, but Flamini just doesn't quite cut the mustard on FM08 compared to ol' Gil.)

r0x0r

Yes i am sure. For a start, a DM is considered a midfielder, so would be included in the "4-5-1" as one of the 5...

Secondly, BigD has made a very good tactic. However, it doesn't play like Arsenal. Arsenal play a flat central midfield, but with different mentalities. Fabregas is positioned next to Gilberto or Flamini (splitting hairs over which i named, as they play the same role and i'm sure Gilberto will be back), but is allowed to play a far more attacking game. So, no DM but two CMs... We do get an AM when we play 4-5-1, but thats because the 4-5-1 only differs from our 4-4-2 by dropping one striker back to AMC.